new map: Illyrstan (fictional land)

Discussion about reviews and strategies for user created scenarios made for RT3 version 1.05 and earlier.
User avatar
brunom
Dispatcher
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:37 pm
Location: Lisbon, Portugal

new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

... And here is the last of my "Other Lands" map. I'm a little tired of carving maps to realism by now, so I won't be starting any more of these for a good while.

I like to vary the maps, in terms of terrain (this one is very mountainous, partially frozen and a large slice of the land is near-deserted), in terms of economy (this map has reindeer!! - although it stupidly calls it cattle) and in terms of scenario goals. Hence, I think you will find this one refreshing...

I also decided to include a wild idea... In this map, you may be assassinated and that will bring the scenario to its end sooner than expected. Still, I don't want to spoil any surprise, so have a look and let me know your thoughts on it. ;-)

Very thankful as always for all comments, yours,
B

--- ATTACHMENT REMOVED ---

For 1.05, does not allow multiplayer, runs between 1926 and 1950, "fictional land", includes one AI player. ( :-) referencing for Sugus' database)
Last edited by brunom on Wed Jul 06, 2011 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
RayofSunshine
CEO
Posts: 1288
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 12:04 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Well, into the 7th year, with $400 in donations, and the assassination percentage never above 4%, and at least 50% as 1%, I get wiped out.
The concept is good, with the challenges presented, plus a fairly good terrain of "rolling" mountains, I thought that I could at least get a BZ medal. The only idea that I can identify with getting wiped out, is that the donations are based on the "amount" in conjunktion with the "real" time. Although it is a 30 year scenario, which would only be a 33% facctor, of which I had not yet reached.
A player has to allocate water/sand maintainence at strategic loations, as this is a "roller coaster" terrain. and if engines are "out of sand", they are destined to be "waylaid" by oncoming trains, or trains with more momentum. I did us the "frontal cab", as it has fairly good incline capatilities. Don't usually us electric due to track cost.
Hope to see some "encouragement" comments from other players. :salute: !*th_up*!
User avatar
brunom
Dispatcher
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:37 pm
Location: Lisbon, Portugal

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Oh, Ray, that sounds so unlucky. In some of my testing, I had to force the assassination almost, by sending the higher amounts possible. Three attempts in 7 years while keeping a low profile really is being short on luck.
Still, if it's possible then the odds are too harsh, and when it happens obviously the player will want to quit and forget it! Hence, I just went and review that bit.

I had made other changes, in the meanwhile, so here's a new version with corrections.

--- ATTACHMENT REMOVED ---

Changelog:
- added two events to curb AI company cashflow and to hold back the AI opponent PNW which was growing too fast.
- placed two extra small fishing villages
- added events to increase Iron production in the southern range once steel production starts up
- reduced the number of times the "assassination" events are tested - it is now tested every 3 or 4 months, instead of monthly - this makes the sudden end of the game 4 times less likely
Last edited by brunom on Sat Jul 09, 2011 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Blackhawk
CEO
Posts: 1112
Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 2:34 pm

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Well I was assassinated. I got the scenario failed message before the newspaper message though so I'm not sure if the order needs to be fixed with that or if the lose scenario message always pops up before a newspaper.

A year into the scenario (the revised one) I managed to trigger the first attempt despite not giving any money. So I reloaded and replayed the year again. I ultimately was taken out around 1942. There were a few years I was around 7% chance as I'd occasionally give money with my company, then go back the next year and give the unnoticed 25k from my personal funds and let the % decline before I'd give money again. But most of the time I was probably around a 3% chance. Although in a future test I think I may just give 250k, then give my personal 25k a few times to get the % chance rate down again and then repeat. I may have a slightly higher rate for a few years, but I'd rather have a few high rate years than have twice as many middle range years.

In my seeding no steel mill appeared in Pisak, nor did a fertilizer factory appear there or anywhere else in the country so that complicated matters with chemicals. I see steel mill is set at 100% in the seeding in Pisak but I haven't had it spawn for me yet. The lack of a steel mill meant I didn't even approach Pisak and I didn't notice there was iron in the mountains east of it. It would also have meant building my own steel mill which would lose money for awhile before I could profitably haul coal and iron there. The lack of a consistent steel source then hurt a weapons factory in Chagyr and meant I couldn't use a tool and die reliably to supply goods to the ports. (It also obviously hurt in the haulage goals.)

To an extent it seems odd to me that I can buy stock in the company in the country that kicked me out. I suppose I could be secretly buying the stock or something. With the way the stock for that company works currently, I was able to buy a few shares in the first year and then it splits 8 to 1. From there I can now use all the extra purchasing power I got from the massive stock split to create a new company with either much more starting capital or owning a greater share of the company from the start. I'm not sure if that was intended or not but I'd figure I'd mention it.
User avatar
brunom
Dispatcher
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:37 pm
Location: Lisbon, Portugal

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Just played another test as well, always on very fast, as I always do when testing... and got assassinated as well, although I was well into Gold in terms of hauls and PNW. I tried the strategy blackhawk just hinted in terms of donations.. big money transfers every now and then, otherwise keeping very low profile - and it almost worked ;-)
Alas... the last playtests always resulted in assassinations so it's still unbalanced. I actually did some probability calculations - when the ledger says 9% chance, there is actually a 25% probability of getting killed during the year (since the attempt happens once every 3 or 4 months)... Definitely, this is too high, so it needs further tuning - I'm on it.

I also went for a different strategy in terms of game-play. I started the company using all the outside investment possible. With those $3.3M laid track between the two ports right away and bought 4 (yes! four!) trains to haul cargo only between them. This was a winner strategy.

I also preferred if the player couldn't touch the other company stock, but do you know any way to do that, Blackhawk? Other than artificially raising the stock price of the TransCoastal to a price that the player can't purchase in the first year, I have no clue what else to do about that topic.

B
User avatar
Blackhawk
CEO
Posts: 1112
Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 2:34 pm

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Hopefully no one tries to give 250k company money in back to back years as the 9% alone has a 25% chance of triggering (if checked 3 times a year, 32.5% chance if checked 4 times a year).

Not to over complicate it, but you could always have it be a lower risk level early on, but as the scenario goes on the risk level increases when you give a donation. It would encourage the player to donate earlier, which may slow company expansion or personal growth. Maybe Krasia (sp?) first takes over and doesn't have all the manpower it needs to secure its new government, but as time goes on they become more entrenched and have more "spies" out there knowing if people are donating to the "rebels." So maybe in the first 5-10 years donating 250k doesn't increase your assassination rate that much (maybe 3-4%), but after that it goes to 9%, and in the last 5 years maybe it's up even more to something like 15%. (The numbers are just for example purpose not actual usage as I have not checked their probability)

Alternatively, maybe the player could hire body guards and that would let him survive an extra attempt on his life, although this option would have to be very expensive and make the player decide whether its worth the extra protection or just to risk it. Of course if you lower the probabilities some this option may end up being moot.


As for TransCoastal, I would have to look at it some and see what can be done exactly. You could have the AI player buy up all the stock so he becomes the sole shareholder, or have the company buy back all the shares of stock. That would solve the problem of having any shares available to be bought, although it may create an artificially high stock price which would cause a large stock split. So you could use an event to lower the stock price so it remains at a normal level. Otherwise, the event for the AI's PNW will trigger and he'll start having negative cash and only stock, and eventually it might be forced to sell off the stock and it'll become available on the market again. There is the possibility that the AI player would issue new stock though which would put new shares available on the market again. [In my first test, and just a few years into my 2nd, the AI player was too rich for the PNW, so the event triggered (at least I think it was the event that caused it) but he ended up having to sell all his stock as his purchasing power got too low. I replayed that period of time again after a saved game, and sold off some of the TransCoastal stock before it happened, and my selling a share of stock caused his purchasing power to drop and so it instantly sold off his stock and crashed the stock from the 70s to the low 20s.
User avatar
brunom
Dispatcher
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:37 pm
Location: Lisbon, Portugal

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Spent some time working the assassination odds and the mechanics concerning the TransCoastal. And here's what I came up with:

--- ATTACHMENT REMOVED ---

- the player will start with stock in TransCoastal, boosted to a very high value. That stock starts to depreciate immediately, so he needs to sell to have money to start a new company in Illyrstan. Transcoastal will remain over appreciated though, and for so long, that investing in it isn't a good idea.
- then, once the player funds a company, he gets a "donation", which gives him a larger share in the company even having less player cash.

As for the assassination odds. I just tuned it, making the risk a notch smaller and the money you can slip a little higher. I also changed the wording in the ledger, instead of mentioning a probability percentage, it's just called "risk level" now.

Finally, I also addressed other details:
. the newspaper with the news of your death (should it happen!) will pop before you get Game Over message.
. hand-placed a Steel Mill in Pisak

This version works much better I think, but the targets of PNW I have included seem a little high. I'll leave it as it is now, and hopefully have enough player testing this version so I can adjust it later. Let me know what you think.

B
Last edited by brunom on Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
RayofSunshine
CEO
Posts: 1288
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 12:04 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Well, this is the result of Illyrstan66(beta2). On my way to a BZ, but fell very short on the PNW.
Chagyr_ 989 hauls Chimkent - 734 hauls Donation - $1.2M and Risk factor of !% Sort of staggered the donations, but never went above $100 fromt the company.
But having to donate, the PNW battled all the way, in trying to attain stock, even with help from the company with as high a divident as permitted. Ended up with $1.7M, and got "booted down the track". BUT, no assassination.
Guess I will have to invest in more stock, right fromt he beginning.
Will see what the Illyrstan63(beta3) will do. :salute: !*th_up*!
RayofSunshine
CEO
Posts: 1288
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 12:04 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Okay Brunom,
Now, remember that I am only playing in the Medium level, so have not idea of a game plan for Hard or Export.
I do see a tremendous change in the program. With all the moneys allotted to a player from the start, it is possible to not only get control of the initial AIs stock at $1 or $2 a share, which then can be sold for an adequate amount to start a railroad. And with the balance of the initial allocation of moneys, a player can buy up a goodly amount of his railroad stock, which could basically be in approximation of $2M of the BZ goal of $5M. A real boon, considering that you had lowered the goals of BZ from $7 to $5, Silver from $10 to $8, and Gold from $15 to $12 millions.

So this was my game plan. Only lay track from Chagyr, expanding each year, until connection is made to Chimkent. And expand from there, so as to accummulate the require hauls. I believe that it is MSU, who uses a haul consist of 0/8, and that is what I allocated to all my trains, and not too often with an MT haul. I also basically only used the Class 500, until the Mallard, and being that I had reached the Gold by 1944, I did not have to incorporate the U1, another good incline hauler.

Initially I donated only $25, alternating it with $100 of personal funds. And considering that there was only 2 Recession periods, I managed to donate $400 from the Company for 4 years. Living dangerous, as that gave me a risk factor of 7. However, for the next 2 years, I would go immediately go back to the $25 personal funding, which would drop the risk to either a 3 or 5, and then back to 1. During 1 of the periods, I was notified that "my son" had been killed, so during that time frame, I did not push more than $25, to lessen the chance of assassination.

By 1944 I had hauls of Chagyr of 1019, and Chimkent of 1334.
PNW of $22.4M and ended up with a 7 of a risk factor of 7. At that point I was awarded the Gold.

I contribute the win factor with this version as a better economy, compared to the previous version. Well a portion of it at least.

Being that I was able to conclude the game during 1944, or at least the end, maybe in Nov or Dec, I believe that the changes are making the scenario a little too easy. If I could do it 5 years short, it could possibly be done in less with the wizardly of MSU and Blackhawk.

I do like the concept, and with adequate incline engines, I don't find the easy inclines a problem. OH, I did not use any tunnels, which I did find to be a possibility if so desired. :salute: !*th_up*!
User avatar
brunom
Dispatcher
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:37 pm
Location: Lisbon, Portugal

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

oops! :oops: :-?

That wasn't definitely my plan... It was completely out of my mind that the player could buy more stock before unpausing. I just considered what would happen after the time started to run... The final version will have the player start with exactly $0 to avoid this exploit !!! :-)

Other than that, everything seems to work fine, doesn't it? I just played another trial, on expert, failed miserably to get any medal. At this point, I think the scenario is finished (still waiting for more testers reports, though). Definitely I can't list it as the easier scenario I ever made, but it works smoothly, so I'm happy (I'm also very happy with the terrain - I just spent some minutes "hovering" around and I am pretty proud of the geography - sorry for the self praise).

cheers, thanks and have a good week
B
User avatar
Hawk
The Big Dawg
Posts: 6503
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:28 am
Location: North Georgia - USA

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Give me a day or two and I'll give it w whirl. Maybe tomorrow - hopefully.
Hawk
User avatar
Hawk
The Big Dawg
Posts: 6503
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:28 am
Location: North Georgia - USA

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

OK! I guess I'm just a dummy. This scenario makes no sense to me.
I start with -$600k company cash, no trains, 40k personal cash and 1,000 shares of my own stock, valued at $1.00 per share.

Not much to work with. **!!!**
Hawk
RayofSunshine
CEO
Posts: 1288
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 12:04 pm
Location: Colorado Springs, CO

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Hawk,
Unless there is a beta 4 to this scenario, I believe that you missid the drift of the initial explanation of text.
YOU no longer are the owner of the Trans Coastal Rwy, and have to start a New Company. But in order to do it, you have to buy stock in it, and then attain an amount of cash, to start the New Company.
Hopes that helps. :salute: !*th_up*!
User avatar
Hawk
The Big Dawg
Posts: 6503
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:28 am
Location: North Georgia - USA

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

$41k is not enough to start a new company.
stock.jpg
start.jpg
I have beta 3.
Hawk
User avatar
Blackhawk
CEO
Posts: 1112
Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 2:34 pm

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

If you wait at least 1 month to sell the stock, the stock goes back up over 100+ and then you can sell it and start a company and you get extra investment money after you start the company. I haven't got very far in beta 3 yet but I'm not sure I really noticed any reason to sell the stock within the first 4 months of the year rather than later in the year (as the introduction message said to sell it within the first trimester of the year) as the stock still seemed pretty stable and profitable.
User avatar
Hawk
The Big Dawg
Posts: 6503
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:28 am
Location: North Georgia - USA

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Ah! I see. Sell within the first trimester. I didn't run that far.
I normally try to do everything I can at the start of the scenario before I ever take it out of pause.

I'm trying to test this map as if I just downloaded it from the archives and never visited the forums for tips, which means that I would not know to unpause the game and wait a while.
Hawk
User avatar
Hawk
The Big Dawg
Posts: 6503
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:28 am
Location: North Georgia - USA

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

OK! So I start a new company, and my goal is to haul freight between Morgan and Myrzakant, which already has a line.
So the only reason to start a new company is to take over the existing company, or build new stations in the same cities as the existing RR and try to take their freight away from them?
Hawk
User avatar
Blackhawk
CEO
Posts: 1112
Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 2:34 pm

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

You want to ship between Chagyr and Chimkemt. (I think the briefing only refers to them as East and West ports though).

You should lack access to the country where the TransCoastal railroad is, as the plot of the scenario is that a hostile political group came to power in that country and drove you out, which is why you are forced to sell your stock in TransCoastal and move to a new country and build a new railroad.
User avatar
brunom
Dispatcher
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:37 pm
Location: Lisbon, Portugal

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

:lol: Hawk, calm down...

Like Ray said, you missed a key point in the intro - the fact that you were ousted from Krasia and that you need to restart your business in the southern country.

Open the scenario (make sure you use the latest version from this thread), unpause, sell the stock you still have from TransCoastal, start a company and then have a look at the ledger. It's a very good scenario (IMHO) once you take these necessary steps ;-)

As the development versions evolved, it came to be that the "international cargo" ports were located in Chagyr and Chimkent only, although, originally, they could pop in different places in both the West and the East coast. Hence the wording in the briefing being as it is. I'll change that as well for the final version.

Generally the the stock value is never higher than it is in the first month, Blackhawk, (normally, around 130k-140k), that's why I left a recommendation to sell in the first trimester. I guess the sneaky player could play the first year with monthly saves and then reload the one with the highest stock value and start the game from there.. I'd call that cheating the system though.

B
User avatar
Hawk
The Big Dawg
Posts: 6503
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:28 am
Location: North Georgia - USA

Re: new map: Illyrstan (fictional land) Unread post

Well, since I never got past unpausing the game at the start, I guess I missed figuring out which countries were which. *!*!*!
I thought I understood the briefing to mean that I had to start in the north.
Hawk
Post Reply