Freight cars

[nedfumpkin]

Edit: re Trainmaster Boxcars download.

If you got here by clicking on the link from the Downloads page for the Trainmaster Boxcars, then you may be a bit confused because the zip for download is for 1.05 and 1.06. What follows is the discussion for the boxcars as defaults in Trainmaster (TM).

If you don't know what Trainmaster is, then you have been seriously missing out but that just my personal opinion, and well....do opinions from Chimpanzees with Raybans really count?

Any ways, the Boxcars are just mixing up how goods are carried to make it easier to identify the contents of those cars from the train list.

It's more important for TM where machinery and paper are necessary commodities for many industries, and while textiles are also necessary, you get the inputs in special cars...wool, cotton, hemp, and still have to mouse over the cars to determine if one of the brown boxcars is hauling textiles. Gotta leave some mystery eh?

In any event, the boxcars are companions to the Rainbow Tankers. Evenutally the hoppers will also be sorted out similarily. This will make customizing skins much easier. Plans are that at some point I will be making it possible to paint road names on the cars and not have a problem with reversed skins on one side, but I have more to do in the mean time before I get to that.




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I'm working on the freight cars now, and I've decided to do a complete over haul and that I will go with a complex system that will only make sense to me. :)

I'm starting with the box cars. I am actively pursuing the idea of using the cargo icons to put art on the side of the cars as much as possible. This way scenario creators will be able to create sheets with roadnames and company names with their scenarios and the cars will automatically show the images.

For the boxcars, I will eventually have 5 eras, and I am going with coloured blanks and they will be as thus:

Brown: Goods, Furniture, Glass,

Dark Blue: Alcohol, Sugar, Flour

Mustard Yellow: Machinery

Green: Paper, Textiles

Orange: Electronics, Plastic, Rubber.

I'm going to try to make the cargo icon to be almost the same size as the side of the boxcar, and then I am going to have icon variations that are tied into the cargo via cargo icon number. This way sugar and Alcohol could have blue boxcars, but different paint schemes.

I'm going to work it out so that there will be icons of different sizes depending on the type of car, and some will be for railroads, others can be for companies. I.e. the railroad could be CN, and on the goods box car it would have a basic brown CN boxcar paint scheme, but on the silver reefer it could have Maple Leaf Foods logo on it for food, and Canada Packers for meat. Etc. Of course, I'll have to lay out a map.


This will be part of the cutsomization aspect of Trainmaster. The idea is to extand this to as many cars as makes sense. A number of defaults will be created, and the user can select their preference. When creating a scenario that uses a specific railroad, the scenario writer can easilt create a custom logo sheet to be used when playing the scenario.

I see this as taking the concept of custom company logos the extra step. Especially if used in conjunction with the interchangeable express sets.

[nedfumpkin]

Other cars that I am going to be making are:

An open style boxcar. A variation of the livestock carrier but for hauling hemp, cotton, wool. I'm thinking a stake car

Reefers:

A silver reefer for meat, food and medicine, and then a yellow reefer for produce.

Covered Hoopers.

In addition to the standard blue, there will be brown, and stainless steel/Aluminium, also white.

gondolas

Currently these are open hoppers, but I also want to make an open hopper that is more like a hopper and less like a gondola.

ammo carrier. I'm also going to make a car for ammo and explosives.

These will also have cargo icons that will display variations.

[nedfumpkin]

I still have to work on getting the colours right, but here are the blue, yellow and orange boxcars. You can see the icon for alcohol on the blue boxcar, but I am going to try to make that to cover most of the side of the car, and then road names could be put on.

[nedfumpkin]

My experiments with using the cargo icons hasn't been going very well. While I have succeeded in making the icon the size of the entire side of the box car, for some reason the game still wants the small image currently used as icons. I tried making the image larger only to discover that the cargoicons.imb file is not actually used. I also tried making the image the size of half the boxcar, but the image still was pretty crappy.

This is making me lean towards creating swappable paks the same as for express cars. This way almost every cargo will have it's own car.

[nedfumpkin]

I've been able to get some work done on the freight cars, specifically an open wagon for hauling waste, and a dark green box car for hauling paper.

I'm dividing the eras for box cars, and using the following cars:

A - 1830 - 1844 - A era box car (wooden sides)

B - 1845 - 1884 - B era box car (wooden sides)

C - 1885 - 1919 - C era box car (wooden sides)

D - 1920 - 1959 - D era stock car (metal sides)

E- 1960 - 1984 - D era box car (metal sides)

F - 1985 - > -- D era box car (metal sides)


I'm using the stock car for 1920-60 because it is larger than the C era box car, but not quite as big as the D era. It's got metal sides and a sliding door. The E and F era are the jumbo box cars.

The paper car is dark green with a white logo on the side, it's a pine tree in a white circle. I'm going to do some other colours, but not all commodities will get their own box cars. Explosives will be in a red box car, machinery in orange, most everything else will be in brown. Produce is in a yellow reefer so I won't be making a yellow box car.

Cotton, wool, hemp and corn will be going in stake cars. Made from Stock cars mostly.

[nedfumpkin]

Boxcars are coming along. I've decided that I am going to use the crgo icons after all. Initially I wanted to put company logos on them but it didn't work out so well, but now I have decided that the cargo icons (what appears on the side of the various cars to show what it is hauling) can be used, albeit, I am pursuinfg a different approach.

I'm working on putting together a set of symbols that will look like stencils on the side of the car. I am going with symbols rather than the cargo icons that appear in the game. Mostly it will be the box cars affected. But also the reefers, stake car, and other cars that carry more than one type of cargo.

I'm also going to make two sets of brown box cars. For the most part they will be identical, but instead, at 1960 when one set goes with the jumbo boxcars from the D era, the other set will go with the 50 foot box car made from the D era stock car.

This is how I did the red box cars used for hauling explosives and ammunition. It provides a boxcar that is a bit smaller than the jumbo, but larger than the C era boxcars.

Still working on the orange and blue set. Orange will be for machinery, blue will be for food products. Brown will be for everything else that goes in a box car, however, some will go in the jumbo set, and the others will go in the other set.

This should give a good mix of boxcars that will make it easier to identify target cargo like paper (green), machinery, etc. I'm not using yellow because it is too easy to confuse it with the produce car,

Eventually I will make the skins on the one-sided cars reversible, and some time in the future I will create some company sets. I'll also make the boxcars available for 1.05 and 1.06 when they are done.

[Grandma Ruth]

This question might be a bit premature, but I'm curious about how the change-over from one era to another will happen? For example in 1845 do all the cars on the rails change to the new design or do they finish their run and then the new cars are of the new design? I expect the latter, as it does now.
Have you been able to get into the game programming to the extent of being able to tamper with the notification that comes up when the cars change from one type to another? You know what I mean, the message that says the cars are going to be heavier and carry more from now on. Or doesn't it matter, as you're only changing the look of them and not the weight?

[nedfumpkin]

A car will empty its load before it gets switched to a new era car. For now the box cars will switch all at the same time, but my plan is to eventually do some staggering of car switches.

The messaghes that come up about larger cars comes from the language file and I changed that to some quote about progress.

[nedfumpkin]

Progress report....

The cars all all made, but now I am testing them and making sure everything is working as it should. I also have to adjust some of the colours on the cars and/or profile images.

[nedfumpkin]

Here are some preview shots of the boxcars from the F era (1985->)

I'm still working out the designs for use as the cargo icons on the sides of the cars. The machinery is a gear, explosives the box design. Hemp on the stake car doesn't show up, but the car does. There's a red one for wool and cotton. The stake car is using the auto carrier - B, and the red and orange box are using the stock car - D. The jumbo box is a box car from D

Still fixing some profile images for the blue set.

[skog]

Hi there,

First of all, thank you so much for making Trainmaster. I've played these games since RRT1, and i've been bummed out since Railroads! turned out to be such a massive dissapointment. This is such a great project.

However i have a problem. I wanted to play GDR1962, where i'm supposed to haul Coffee. But the game had no coffee in it as far as i could see, so i tried to install this. I have v 1,5, and used the 1,5 files. But still the game crashes to the desktop regardless of which scenario i try to load up, in the beginning when it says "building database".

When i rolled back the install, it works again. Any ideas as to why? I've played RRT3 and trainmaster for hours and hours before doing this install so it definately works without the rainbow car set.

[Hawk]

If you're trying to play a 1.05 or 1.06 map in TM it's not going to work right. Only TM maps should be played in TM.

Most of us have 2 or 3 installs of RT3. A 1.05 install, a 1.06 install, and a TM install.

[skog]

If you're trying to play a 1.05 or 1.06 map in TM it's not going to work right. Only TM maps should be played in TM.

Most of us have 2 or 3 installs of RT3. A 1.05 install, a 1.06 install, and a TM install.

Aha, launching it from TM worked before installing. But i guess that means the map only required standard 1.5 files, so it doesen't interfere with the TM files.

[Hawk]

Aha, launching it from TM worked before installing.

Launching what from TM worked before installing what? That statement is a bit confusing.

With all the changes made to RT3 to create TM, only maps designed for TM will work right in TM. Maps designed for 1.05 and 1.06 will not work right in TM.

[skog]

Aha, launching it from TM worked before installing.

Launching what from TM worked before installing what? That statement is a bit confusing.

With all the changes made to RT3 to create TM, only maps designed for TM will work right in TM. Maps designed for 1.05 and 1.06 will not work right in TM.

Hang on, is GDR 1962 designed for TM? Or RRT3? What i ment was that a played it from TM before i installed these files and it worked, cept there was no coffee to be found anywhere, which made me realise i missed something.

[Hawk]

Oh! I think I see what you're saying now. You installed the freight cars into TM and that's when the map quit loading. Right?

GDR1962 is not a TM map. The only place to get TM maps is in the TM Map Archive http://hawkdawg.com/rrt/rrt3/TM/tm-map_index.htm
You will have problems with all other maps in TM.

I think coffee was changed in TM. That might be why it didn't show up on the map. Ned could probably answer that question better. Maybe he'll pop in this evening.

As for the freight cars causing TM to crash, that will better be answered by Ned also, unless Blackhawk pops in with an answer, or someone else more knowledgeable than I on the subject.

[Blackhawk]

Only maps with TM in their name (or the TM campaign maps) on Hawk's TM download page will work properly in TM. A 1.05 or 1.06 map MAY load in TM, however, there will be issues. In this case no coffee, since coffee is not a cargo in TM. Another person had issues with passengers being valued at nothing and not transporting. Other times loading a 1.05 or 1.06 map may just crash TM all together.

If you like the GDR1962 map a lot you could always try converting it to work in TM. (obviously goals requiring coffee would need to be changed) and you might need the author's permission. [edit - Molse's site says the map was for 1.05, well in one place it says 1.05 and another it says 1.03, but he was also the creator] Edbangor wrote a guide with some tips on how to convert a 1.05/1.06 map into a TM map.

If TM is crashing after you installed the rainbow freight cars files, I'd uninstall them. I think TM already took advantage of them as there are multiple colors for tankers and box cars depending on what is being hauled. If uninstalling the freight car files doesn't work to make TM run again, you may just want to do a fresh install of TM as it might be possible a required TM file was overwritten. When you test to see if TM loads correctly, be sure to use a TM map.

Bottom line, GDR 1962 won't work properly on TM without making some changes to the map.

[Hawk]

Let me see if I can clarify things a bit.

1.05 maps will work in 1.05 and 1.06, although due to the changes made in 1.06 they will not play as intended.

1.06 maps will only work in 1.06.

TM Maps will only work in TM.

You could possibly load a 1.05 or 1.06 map in TM but it won't play right, if it loads at all.

That's why it's a good idea to have 3 separate installs. A 1.05 install. A 1.06 install. A TM install.

Does that help?

[nedfumpkin]

What Blackhawk said! :)

To add to that....the rainbow tankers and box cars that are available as separate downloads are for 1.05 and 1.06. They are the TM cars that are made avaiable for those versions. TM comes with it's own cars.

Trainmaster is designed to use custom paks, and so you should only ever use those, don't change any of the rail cars or else it won't work. Custom paks are like what was made for Persian Electric, and the new CPR Express 1950. The are just the car model files in a pk4 file that can be used to override the defaul cars. It's actually pretty easy since it is just moving the file from one folder (storage) to another (data\3d\).

The Persian Electric custom pak has a locomotive skin and passenger cars for the fictional Persian Star Railway, for the period that the scenario covers. They were purchased on the used railcar market by Darius Ali, and are basically German cars with a new paint job. It also includes a fruit reefer with a palm tree on it since Solid Gold/Cold reefers are not likely to be found in Iran. I think there's another car in there, but forget which one.

So when you play Persian Electric, you move the custom pak into the 3d folder, and move any express sets out, and while you play you will have those cars for that period. When playing a different map, switch express sets and you can have new cars all around.

The CP Express set is just the FP7 with the CP paint scheme from 1950s, the other cars are the Budd cars in the CP paint scheme from the 1950s. Having this set in 3D will make all your cars from 1950 until the end of time use these cars and loco skin if the FP7 is available in the game.

I am currently working on a full Canadian Express set. I've got most of it done, but it takes a long time. There are 10 possible Mail and First Class cars, and 8 mail cars in a set.

It is also possible to make custom freight car sets, and in time I will be making some of those. Someone else is working on a livery for some locomotives, so the possibilities are endless. There is a rolling stock developer's kit available for making custom paks. (Although I have to update some of the docs some day)

Next month it will be 2 years since Trainmaster was started. Most of that time was spent creating all the stuff that is there now, and making it play well. There a few minor tweaks that need to be done, and I am working towards them. But otherwise, I think it is a good game as another version of RT3, but certainly not a replacement. It was never meant to be. Back when Vista came out, 1.06 wouldn't work and this was started as something for Vista...then the fix was found, but that just opened up TM to new things since the 1.06 exe became the basis for the TM exe, although some features were removed.

Trainmaster maps take longer to make because they are more difficult to make. TM likes big maps, or else the small ones have to be properly balanced for cargo. TM is much more flexible in the editor because of the added features in the exe, so it allows for more possibilities in scenarios...it's going to take time to figure out its potential and get new maps made, but they are coming, and there are some excellent maps out there.

Currently I am working on rail cars, once I am done that I will be working on some maps. I have the general ideas worked out, just got to make the maps themselves.

Something I would suggest about converting maps to TM. I really don't think anyone would mind if a mpa was created out of someone elses as long as credit to the original person is made appropriately. So if you really like GDR 1962, then feel free to convert it and indicate it's credit to the proper creator in the main message.

Finally, TM has a supply chain that is a mix of RT2, RT3 1.05 and RT3 1.06 with some subtractions and additions. Coffee was replaced by gold. Although coffee is the most valuable commodity traded, it falls under the more gernal food category, and Gold was more useful in the game. (And yes Blackhawk, gold is both metal and currency in TM...still thinking about the tavern...will get back to you)



Note to add to what Hawk posted.....1.05 maps most likely will load in the TM editor, some 1.06 might load. But seems best to start from scratch with the map maker or a base map, at least for me.

[Blackhawk]

For your convenience if you don't know how to do multiple installations of RT3 see this thread: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2363&p=22786&hilit=installs#p22786

Edit: For Vista and Win 7 users, it's best to install RT3 and any RT3 variations into their own folder, rather than in the programfiles folder, otherwise it becomes difficult to find where you games and screenshots are saved.