Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

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Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Lama » Fri Jun 10, 2011 4:25 pm

Now, before you take this as me nagging, let me say that the lure of Trainmaster was a major reason for me to pick back up RT3 and its derivatives. And so far I've not been disappointed. I have been working on a port of the Weidenthal map. I'm thinking it's best to start small.

In doing so, however, I ran into two issues I wanted to share & run by people here. I figured I'd start a thread for that, since there'll be sure to be more questions where these came from.

1) I tried using the Theme Park. It did not demand or supply passengers when placed by event, and disabled in industries. So I made sure to enable it, and that all cargo it demands and supplies, other than passengers, finds suppliers and demanders. These cargoes now do show up in the Theme Park, but still no passengers. A station placed at an isolated Theme Park generated no passenger traffic. A second one, built manually after making the above changes, likewise behaved no differently. I ran the game for a year just to be sure. No pax.

2) I have tried in vain to get German express cars to show up. I've read every single instruction I could find on this board on that subject. They were sometimes appearing to be contradictory, but I covered all angles by placing the German_Express_Cars.pk4 in data/3d, .../poptopextracontent, AND .../userextracontent. The North American express cars pk4 has been banished to the subfolder 'Custom Packs', and yet those are the ones that keep showing up in game, exclusively.
You said that this may be a matter of the era, so to be able to control for that, could you please post here what eras are covered by the German car sets (express and troops)?
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Blackhawk » Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:22 pm

I can't say I know much about the theme park or sea world and if they demand/supply PAX.

As for the custom paks, I think viewtopic.php?f=70&t=2517 may be the latest on how the paks work. I think there was a time when where things were supposed to go got changed so some of the threads may have conflicting information. I know I just put the german express pak into my /data/3d folder (it's the only thing in my 3d folder right now on this version of TM, on another version of TM i've got several things there, but that's an older version of TM) and moved the blue express cars out of the TM folder completely just to check and make sure it worked. And then I ran in sandbox in the year 1960 and put a train with passenger cars on it and the german cars rather than the default blue cars were used. If Ned doesn't respond more to this, I'll look and see if I can figure out exactly what I did when I installed them. I'm unsure if the German express cars cover all the eras, but I know they definitely covered the modern era.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Lama » Fri Jun 10, 2011 9:09 pm

Thanks for your help!

One clarification:

Blackhawk wrote:the german express pak is the only thing in my 3d folder right now on this version of TM


where did you put all the other files from there, then?
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby El Moichi » Sat Jun 11, 2011 8:32 am

Lama wrote:You said that this may be a matter of the era, so to be able to control for that, could you please post here what eras are covered by the German car sets (express and troops)?


The German troop/express car set was made by Holger Jürgenliemk and is the same set which is available for the standard RRT3 game. You can find it here in the download area and you could check the included readme file. As far as I know, all eras in the game are covered while the skins of these cars change, depending on the actually occuring time period.

http://hawkdawg.com/rrt/rrt3/Xtras/Rollingstock.htm
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Blackhawk » Sat Jun 11, 2011 12:06 pm

data/2d = trainmaster.pk4
data/3d = trainmaster_expresscars_german.pk4

my userextra content/custom paks directory is empty

and everything else seems to be in the data/poptopextracontent directory.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby El Moichi » Sun Jun 12, 2011 9:28 am

I´ve tried out both the Theme Park and the Sea World.

The Supply Chain Guide says that there would be both supply and demand of 5 loads of passengers.

But if you build one and look into the window where the supply and demand is shown, everything is there but no passengers are displayed.

theme park.jpg

(screenshot is from my German TM version).

So, I assume *someone* simply forgot to add the PAX supply/demand while constructing these buildings.... :-D
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Hawk » Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:04 am

If I'm not mistaken, I don't believe passenger supply/demand ever shows up in that window.
Both of those industries would just add the passenger supply/demand to that of the station.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby El Moichi » Sun Jun 12, 2011 12:59 pm

Hawk wrote:If I'm not mistaken, I don't believe passenger supply/demand ever shows up in that window.


Sometimes it shows up... for example, start the Aperi-Ski map and click on that Fort at Capitol City.

But in general you are right here, the missing passenger demand in that window is not a sure hint.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Lama » Sun Jun 12, 2011 4:09 pm

Sure, Hawk. But I placed a station next to one, with coverage, and had that station connected to my full network, and there was never a single load available at the Theme Park station, in a full year.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Hawk » Sun Jun 12, 2011 4:30 pm

Well, maybe I'm mistaken then. **!!!** (**!!sry
I haven't played TM in a while.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Lama » Sun Jun 12, 2011 5:05 pm

Well, you're right that, in some buildings that do demand/supply pax (like the museum or hotel), they are not shown; and that them not showing in this case, by itself, is not an indication of anything. Hence my clarification.

On the original subject: Thanks, blackhawk, for the additional information. I eventually figured out that I had made a mistake, i.e. using the express & troops cars that had been designed for RT3 1.06! Now all is well, and I enjoy the German designs. They are so familiar (from the 60s type onward), I can virtually smell them!
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby nedfumpkin » Sun Jun 12, 2011 6:56 pm

Passengers won't show up in the theme park window because they are set in a different area of the file. They will demand and produce passengers, but it can be difficult to get it going...try redirecting a load of passenges there and leaving them for a while. Theme parks are meant to be money losers.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby nedfumpkin » Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:00 pm

Make sure you don't have and cars in your userextracontent folder.

Take all express cars out of 2d, 3d, and poptopextra content.

Put the German express cars in poptop extra content.

This should work. The german set will be your default. All express car sets will cover the entire game eras unless specified otherwise as a cutom pak.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby Lama » Sun Jun 12, 2011 8:47 pm

nedfumpkin wrote:try redirecting a load of passenges there and leaving them for a while.


Please explain why that would help? Houses do not respond to that, either, in that they spawn pax/mail at regular intervals, no matter what you do, right? How does the Theme Park differ in its mechanism from the way houses work?

nedfumpkin wrote:Theme parks are meant to be money losers.


As with the publishing house issue, industry profit is besides the point, as this map does not allow industry ownership.
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Re: Lama's list of things he doesn't understand

Unread postby nedfumpkin » Sun Jun 12, 2011 9:07 pm

I'm not sure what to say because theme parks have worked on maps with passengers. Perhaps placement or it takes time for passengers to want to go, but it should produce and demand 5 passengers per year.
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