RRT3 and Windows Vista... a solution

[HighVoltage]

anyway, on my search for compatible and non-compatible (as well as so-so compatible ) software I came across this (last sentence being interesting!)

Railroad Tycoon 3 with v1.05 patch and Coast to Coast Expansion - crashes as soon as the main menu loads with no explanation. I've tried all compatibility modes with no success; I've tried RT3's batch files that load its safe modes/windowed/no sound modes without success. Intro video plays but that's it. On Vista 64-bit, AMD Athlon X2 4200+, GeForce 7600GT.
!!!!!!!!!I also experienced this problem running vista 32 bit until I disabled Windows Defender, while not the ideal solution it should allow the game to run problem free. !!!!!!!!!!!!



EDIT: here's another link....some solutions, some work for some, some don't work for some....
http://www.ntcompatible.com/Railroad_Ty ... 13397.html

[HighVoltage]

btw, if you are considering Vista... STAY AWAY from Home Basic... spend the extra $$$ on Home Premium or better.. Basic is a real pain in the behind to manage files in....

just purchased a new Dell notebook (hasn't arrived yet) and...well, I didn't consider Vista...it comes with the notebook as a trojan horse
so I really didn't want to spend ANY more money on that I&$$!?/+'* Vista...hell, there are at least 6 (or is it 8?) Versions of that operating system!!

considering downgrading to my old XP again, but then there are a few features which won't work WITHOUT Vista ....double
seems like purchasing a new *graphics-adventure opearting system game* forces you to buy a new computer due to crazy system requirements and, buying a new computer, in turn, requires to get a new operating system

[ostlandr]

Thank you HighVoltage!!!!

Did a clean install of RRT3 on the desktop off the CD, then installed the 1.04 beta patch from gamershell, ran it in compatibility mode for Windows 98/ME (disable visual themes) with the " -s9" switch, and it works! Never seen RRT3 with the graphics set all the way up before- it's gorgeous!

Gonna play around with adding user content if I can. Wish me luck!

!!! Just came across this page !!!!

didn't read through this whole thread, but will do so in the evening

http://kb.gametap.cust-serv.com/gametap ... type=match

I couldn't check it out yet, because I don't have the PC with Vista yet...

but might help

[HighVoltage]

congrats


np. I just posted the links there not knowing if the tips there would lead to success or not - but anyway, glad it did for you, so I hope it will do for me as well



EDIT to above:
lucky me DID purchase the Vista Home PREMIUM edition with the notebook, as this was the lowest version that was offered with it hip hip

OH, WAIT.... it is STILL Vista

[HighVoltage]

I do recall reading somewhere that someone was successful in patching RRT3 on a Vista machine by first deleting (or moving - preferably) the RRT3.exe file before installing the patches.

this is mainly the thing with installing the C2C to a ghost directory and then move and overwrite everything BUT the RT3.exe file.... isn't it?!

btw 1.04 beta works fine for me here including all C2C addons

[Hawk]

this is mainly the thing with installing the C2C to a ghost directory and then move and overwrite everything BUT the RT3.exe file.... isn't it?!

Not from what I understood when I read it. The poster was saying he moved the RT3.exe file from the main directory before installing any patches.
It seems the problem with Vista has to do with overwriting existing exe files. Apparently it doesn't like doing that. So - by moving the existing RT3.exe file out of the main RRT3 directory, the patch doesn't have to overwrite the existing exe so presumably the patched exe will then work.

I would strongly caution against deleting the existing exe file though, in case you have to revert back to it. Simply move it to another location on your hard drive.
I can't test this because I don't run Vista but I am curious if this works or not.

This trick supposedly works with the 1.05 and 1.06 patches.

[HighVoltage]

ah, I see...will try it out



btw tried this solution
http://www.gametap.com/forums/thread.js ... 0&tstart=0 as well as this thread: http://www.gametap.com/forums/thread.js ... 751&#11751
(see also http://kb.gametap.cust-serv.com/gametap ... type=match )
but even the downloadlinks for these 2 files didn't work ... anymore

but from what I get this is another special release / software support type of thing like that one from Steam or whatever it's called...

[Hawk]

That release from Steam, or whatever it's called, doesn't come with the Map Builder and it's heavily modified and it seems you can't install the 1.05 or the 1.06 patch on it in any system, although I believe it comes with a modified version of the C to C expansion.

[HighVoltage]

HOOOORRRRRAAAYYYYYYYY

I've finally nailed it!

running 1.06 on Vista Home Premium 32 bit + nVidia card (8700M GT SLI) now!!!



did a blank install of RT3,
then a ghost install of Coast to Coast and moved these files into the RT3 folder afterwards,
did the same with the 1.06 patch: ghost install into a directory where the original 1.05 was located in, copied these files into the RT3 folder again
and finally started the game with the 1.04 beta exe file!

I went into the editor, and all additional buildings like the ore mine and so on were there!
On the start menu screen it EVEN SAYS 1.06 beta patch (NOTE: before it always said 1.04 beta patch!!!)
(please also note that I installed the final 1.06 release downloaded from this palced today - file was "setup06.exe" with 24.780KB!)

No special settings like Compatibility mode or anything like that (disabling desktop themes...) used

this said, I didn't test every feature of the 1.06 if its working correctly - but the fact that they are displayed in the game is VERY GOOD!

[Aesir Rising]

Vista's "Trusted Computing" strikes again. Specifically the 'sealed storage' and probably the 'memory curtaining' aspects of the TC model.

Older or otherwise non-standard (according to Microsoft programming rules/guidelines) updates or patches may not work because the operating system might protect the .exe or .dll files involved in an update. Even if the update goes through successfully, if certain criteria isn't met, Vista will go back and replace the updated protected files (like program executables and DLLs) with whatever version it was caching at the time (the most prior version in most cases). That's not a 100% accurate statement, but it's true for most instances where this issue occurs and good enough for a topic post that isn't intended to be a white paper on Vista's security and end-user so-called "Trusted Computing" model.

That's why the solution involved retaining a copy of the updated versions of the .exe files and manually copying them back in -again - after patching. I'd be willing to bet that the prior crashes/symptoms were exactly like what you'd get if you tried to run CtC + v1.05 data files with a 1.03 or older RT3.exe file on any system, not just Vista. And if another person re-copies the files in at the 'wrong' time, Vista will over-write the change - again. So timing comes into play when trying that method. One additional 'trick' if this doesn't work is to logoff or even just power off, right after you copy the file by hand. But that's not a very elegant way of doing things.

Trusted Computing, protected file caching, and "virtualization" of protected folders (essentially presenting a decoy) of program and system folders are all potentially beneficial from a system security and stability perspective - but my biggest gripe is that if you don't know the ins/outs of Vista you've given up control of your computer and the programs and data that exist on your computer (literally, with no exaggeration). It's a slippery slope though. The days where your data is assumed private are long gone, whether you run Vista now or wait until some other operating system comes along, Trusted Computing is de-facto part of what computing is and will be for the mainstream end-user.

[Edited: I found the editor in my Steam install. In the game's "Extras" menu just as described in the .PDF copy of the manual. I loaded up a Spain.TGA heightmap and flew around with the camera. Looks awesome! There's also a skinning, portrait, and logo creation 'suite' of utilities and batch programs.]

[coruscate]

Has this truly worked? Anyone not getting it to work?

I'm curious to try all the new stuff...

[HighVoltage]

yes, I tried it out again today - started it with the RT3 1.04 beta patch exe!

here you have the start screen which says 1.06 beta patch (instead of 1.04 beta patch):


Here you see the new buildings in the editor list:


well, and here I've built a quarry and an ore mine in the editor:






couldn't get the 1.05 patch to run, however...
what was introduced in the 1.05 version? only a few things, right? but if I understand correctly, all these bugs that have been addressed in 1.05 should be available in 1.06 anyway....well, we will see!

[Hawk]

[Edited: I found the editor in my Steam install. In the game's "Extras" menu just as described in the .PDF copy of the manual. I loaded up a Spain.TGA heightmap and flew around with the camera. Looks awesome! There's also a skinning, portrait, and logo creation 'suite' of utilities and batch programs.]

Yes, the editor is there, but the Map Builder isn't.
The Map Builder is a separate program that came with the cd versions of RRT3. It's about a 225 MB program - zipped.

[HighVoltage]

EDIT to my message above:

While I have been able to load the game with the new goods, maps created with 1.06 (2 maps tested - UTOPIA II and SOMEWHERE) don't appear in the menu (as I've still started the game with the 1.04 beta)...I guess the maps check the exe directly...
(However, when I created a map which uses some 1.06 cargo and then saved it, I could see the map in the menu!)

oh, also when I looked in the editor, I couldn't find this trigger that checks for 1.06... am I just blind, or is this one feature which is implemented in the 1.06 exe itself and therefore not available here when I start the game with the 104 beta?
can some of the 1.06 modders maybe shed some light on the features that DO require the actual 1.06 exe (as some features which are implemented with extra files such as the buildings and cargos DO work with the 104beta)?!

thanks

PS: I copied this message into the 1.06 section as well!


EDIT:
Here's what in 1.05 was introduced:
1. Fixed a multiplayer crash bug inadvertantly introduced in patch 1.04.
2. Resolved the bug that could cause trains to slow to 1 m.p.h. sometimes when approaching stations and/or service towers.
3. Fixed a bug that would cause industries with 2 possible inputs (i.e. textile mill), to produce at only half of their targeted rate, even when supplied with both inputs.

so apparently in the 1.04 beta there can occur this 1mph crawl again, for example? Can anyone who is already using the 1.04 beta for some time confirm or deny this?

[nedfumpkin]

Have you been able to load a map and then save it, or have it autosave after the first year? This tends to be the biggest problem for people who can't play 1.06 patched games.

In the editor, are you able to get values to display in the conditions and effects? I couldn't see what I was typing so it made creating maps tedious and most of the time it wouldn't take.

These are issues with the 1.06 patch that have come up for me, and they are patch specific it seems.

[HighVoltage]

yes...Ive loaded a game (which has been started usind this version - I didn't use my older savegames yet, as they use User Created content such as skins and I've not installed them to the Vista installation of RT3 yet, so these games would crash when trying to load)...however, I can load all maps (that are displayed) with the editor just fine...also Autosave works fine

coudn't find out anything about event triggers othe than the fact that the "Version #" checker was not available - the specific actions concerning the new goods were there however
well, I could see some new features in the effect window: there's not only TRUE or FALSE or "+", "-" and "=", but also *, &, !, /, |, @, <, >, and # (though there are no descriptions displayed in the text line on the bottom...
Ah, now I see what you wrote about not being able to see what you type...you mean this little dropdown field below the 2 radio buttons 'Value' and 'Variable'...NO, I can't see if there is some text in there or if I can/do write in this field either...

still, don't know if they are 1.06 patch issues or Vista issues, as I've not experienced the 1.06 longer than a few days yet...

[Butler]

After 10 hours of solid searching and seemingly 50 reinstalls, I think I found the solution to the Windows Vista problem. I discovered a BETA patch that was released from Take2, and is available at Gamers Hell.

The v1.04 Beta, available here: http://www.gamershell.com/download_5729.shtml appears to have all the functionality of the Coast to Coast expansion, and is completely stable on Windows Vista/DX10. It allows for custom content (user locos, skins, and logos), and seems to work with custom maps from the download archives at this site.

I installed this patch on a clean install of RRT3, tested, and it worked. I then installed the C2C expansion to a ghost directory, and copied all files EXCEPT the .exe file, testing again with positive results. I then began adding user content (Including the loco pack) and this also worked. Then I tried to add the v1.06 beta, and this caused the game to crash again.

My wife has been playing RRT3 all morning, with no crashes or hangups, all user content is working (even in the campaign mode). Later today, I am going to do a ghost install of the v1.06 patch and try using the methods I used with C2C and see if adding buildings and cargos will function, however, maybe now that we have a stable Vista version, a new patch can be developed using v1.04 beta to accomplish the same things.

Anyhow, I am new to these forums, and I'd like to thanks everyone here who has developed these wonderful add-ons to this game, and hopefully I can continue to contribute here.

Thanks
Ross

-edit-
BTW I Suppose I should put in some system specs here for comparison purposes:

Pentium Dual Core 3.0GHz
1GB DDR2
ASUS NVidia 6200
Sound Blaster Audigy 2ZS
140GB and 200 GB HDDs

I know this is kinda old but I have tried the same, With no luck. I cant get the initial RRT3+1.4b. But I am also not clear on what you mean installing CtoC in a "ghost Dir". What did you specifically do? Extract to a generic folder and copy the files minus .exe to main C:\...Program...\RRT3? Also my download of Coast to coast only contains a word doc, and an EXE. I would greatly appreciate any help.

[Hawk]

Butler - check this thread. I believe there's more info about RT3 and Vista in it.

viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1391

[coruscate]

Butler, it sounds strange, but that's exactly what I did. Now on the other hand, I had not yet encountered Vista problems yet in that regard, so perhaps all i did was a placebo maneuver.

[Butler]

****UPDATE****


Ok I went to NVidia and downloaded newer Drivers for my laptop's Graphics card. Drivers updated for Vista SP1. Now RRT3 1.04b is WORKING! I just messed around in the tutorial. So now the big question should I copy files (Coast to Coast) from Ghost folder and paste into main DIR? Or just install Coast to Coast regularly?