Mexico

[Hawk]

The following text is a compilation of what was salvaged from the old Gathering Forum. It contains postings from several different people.
Thanks goes out to Wolverine for putting this all together.

Hawk

Mexico - Added in the Coast to Coast Expansion
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Whew! Mexico was tough. Almost no cargo and it doesn't stay profitable for long. Had to spend first several years buying industries and stacking up the money and building a cash flow that would support a money draining railroad. The cheap track option was the way to go here. The economy and everything eventually improves way late in the game and then I was rolling in dough.
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Took me a few tries to get started and I always had to start at the coast, buy industry, and eventually got to Mexico City and Chihuahua?, or however it is spelled. Yes I agree, it was tough.
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When you start you should see some iron mines somewhere south of Chihuahua. Make sure you also have some coal mines in the area, otherwise restart.
Since the map starts in 1870 you can build a tool and die right in the middle of the iron mines which will make money. You should be able to upgrade it after a couple of years. In 1876 you should build a steel factory (that's why you need coal) in the same area. Also add another tool and die
Only after that build track. You will be making so much money that the rest is very easy.
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Well thanks to the above hints I managed to qualify for Silver on Expert so can confirm they work. I upgraded both the Steel Mill and Tool & Die but think upgrading the Steel is a waste of money as shortly after it started to lose money. To complete my railroad in time I had to take about $5m in Bonds and after that it was hopeless, although I did manage to pay off quite a few of them and start making profits again by selling the now heavy loss making Steel Mill.
So that was that. Silver my sad lot Not at all. Despite not having got anywhere near America let alone Houston I was awarded Gold! So that's another CtoC with a major flaw/quirk in it!!!!

[Orange46]

Joined: 12 Nov 2006
Posts: 60

Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:57 pm Post subject: Mexico 2

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My return to RT3 after playing SMR and some new RT2 scenarios has been well rewarded. Mexico 2 is another fun scenario, especially if you like to build track and run a railroad, while trying to jump start Mexico's industries.

The last time I played a Mexico scenario I started in the highlands, so this time I decided to go low. I wanted gold and that required a Houston connection, so the Gulf coast to the western Rio Grande seemed like the way to go. After struggling for 5 years, I wasn't so sure. Where are the lucrative cargoes. Let's scan the map. Hmmm, there aren't any production industries. I guess I have to build them, and industry profits are required to get a silver medal. What to build. Textiles might work, but I'm strapped for cash and all of the raw materials are on the wrong side of the Rio Grande or up on the highlands. In fact, there are lots of raw materials up there. Oh well, I'm down here. I drop the textile idea, since I can't purchase the raw material producers and most are very far away, so I will be running in the red for longer than I can afford. Fortunately, there's lots of sugar reaching my side and we do like to drink. Now, where's that worm.

Eventually I needed to find a way to get up to Mexico City, and after a lot of seaching I found one. It wasn't the path that KCS de Mexico currently runs on, (thru Saltillo) but further west, starting in Nuevo Laredo as does the KCS. There's lots of US traffic begging to come and go but at $10 million to get access, there's no way. Maybe if I complete the bronze and silver goals it will get cheaper. The scenario gives you 5 extra years for gold. Running down to Mexico City and buying a starving steel mill in San Luis Potosi result in a nice boost to profitability and the final track to Chihuahua complete my silver asperations, but the price to America is still too high. Oh well, those gringos seem to want to keep me out.

My only disappointments with this scenario were that by the time got in to the US, I was able to quickly get to Houston and didn't get to enjoy making oodles more of money with the gringo traffic. (I lose the incentive to play once I get the gold.) The other disappointment was that there was no port in Lazaro Cardenas to build to, not that I could see any kind of decent route to the west coast. In fact, there were no ports at all. But, despite this, I found this to be a very enjoyable scenario.

[Mish Mish]

Appologies for dredging up old threads, but I did want to comment on this map.

I have had pretty much a lifelong interest in Mexico's railroads, and as you might expect I was eager to play this map when I first got it. As Hawk noted in a previous post, there is very little traffic at the beginning of the scenario, and the first few years provide rather meager opportunities. This coupled with the extremely steep gradients in many places caused me to lose interest in this map.

I really enjoy being able to replicate railroads that were actually built, such as the Sud Pacifico de Mexico/FCP line along the west coast, or the Chihuahua al Pacifico line from Ojinaga/Chihuahua/Los Mochis. But with the map as it was, that was pretty much undoable.

I should explain that I am a fastidious tracklayer. I try if at all possible to hold my track to 3% or less. I will go as steep as 4% for short sections if I can't find any better path. That holds fairly close to the very limit of what real railroads can do without resorting to such extreme measures rack and pinion, cable ways or the like.

This began a long process of modifying this map. I "squashed" the map elevation back to something that made flatter trackbuilding possible, and I found that I could build many more of the routes that actually exist.

Once I downloaded the 1.06 patch I wanted to upgrade this map with the new commodities, and that was fairly straght forward. That opened the window to a process of tweaking the map overall. In some cases I have changed cities to more closely reflect cities and town that have importance in real life. I also have spent a lot of time tweaking the commodities overall. There are some aspects that I am still not completely happy with, but over all I have the map modified so that pretty much all commodities are potentially in play. I also spent some time redecorating the map.

I have not as of yet created any complete new scenarios, but I have one partially complete.

If anyone has any interest in some "fun" scenario play with my modified map, I will make it available for you to try out. (I could make the game goals PNW/LIP/CBV based so that you could build anywhere you wanted to )

[KevinL]

I had the same problem when I tried this map. The mountains were so high and the track so steep that it was not any fun to watch the trains creep along at less than 5 MPH.

[Beancounter]

I'm "glad" to see that other people find this map chellenging. I thought I was missing something.

Personally, though, I'd rather not build other industries. The game is about railroads after all. And I also feel like I'm cheating if I modify the orignal scenario.

[Elliott]

This map does seem difficult to start with if you try to lay rail. If only you could start in Texas!

The idea posted in Hawk's post of plonking down a tool and die near the iron mines was excellent however. I've heard this strategy being bounded about and to be honest I'm not a fan of it, purely because I want to build rail, not build industries that don't move and can't be dragged around the map etc. But it seems mandatory in this map and doing it in this map has really opened me up to the benefits of using it on other maps as well.

I did this map with plenty of time on gold and could've done it quicker too, but I decided to build rail to other places just for the hell of it first. Whereas when I tried to start with rail, I couldn't even find somewhere good to start, and the railway was doomed to die.

[Moggie]

I took a page of Hawk's book and before laying the first mile of track, built a Tool & Die between two Iron Mines. Laid tracks to a nearby town, which also happened to have coal being produced nearby. Took a financial gamble and built a Steel Mill there. ... ... It worked like a charm. Reached Gold a couple of years before the deadline. I'm sure some of you have go there around 1880 but this was a good achievement for me.

[Hawk]

I took a page of Hawk's book...

What book is that? I don't think I've ever written a book, at least not that I recall.

[BikerTim]

I agree that this is a tough scenario. I found it exasperatingly difficult until I decided to buy and build industries before building railroads. The area around the iron mines is good for a tool and die. Once the coal and iron mines become intermixed, steel mills really pay off. Then the products from the tool and die and from the steel mills can be shipped to the cities, making the railroads a much better investment. Since following this strategy, I have never missed getting a gold medal.

[Logales]

I have a problem, I can't buy a tool industry since it costs £$ 1.6 M. Is there anything I am missing ?

[Hawk]

Not sure what you mean by you 'can't buy it'. You can buy it if you have 1.6 mil.

[Logales]

The advice is to buy industry before laying tracks... But I can't since I don't have enough money so how can I follow the advice ?

[Hawk]

Ah! That's what you mean.

Look for other industry to buy. Grain fields are generally cheap and always make a profit. If you can afford a dairy farm or two, they're pretty profitable too.

[Lone Cat]

This map is tough! can't find the way to pass it (and a competitor always start in better position)

And what is an industry do your guys recommend me/us to start with?

[Moggie]

A dairy farm, if bought before starting the game rolling, is a very good source of income. But they go up in price really quick.

[Gumboots]

I agree that this is a tough scenario. I found it exasperatingly difficult until I decided to buy and build industries before building railroads. The area around the iron mines is good for a tool and die. Once the coal and iron mines become intermixed, steel mills really pay off. Then the products from the tool and die and from the steel mills can be shipped to the cities, making the railroads a much better investment. Since following this strategy, I have never missed getting a gold medal.

^ ^ This.

For more detail, I do it like this.

1/ Make sure the map has iron and coal up around Torreon. This is the best way to launch your rocket.

2/ Tool and die those iron mines pronto. You can just afford this if you go for bonds and stock. If the map is good, production will start almost immediately and the factory will be close enough to Torreon to have a good market.

3/ Sit back and rake in the cash for a bit, then start development down at Reynosa as soon as you can afford it. Usually there will be good money in a distillery, brewery, meat packing plant (more rarely) or textile mill. Build whatever will bring in the most moolah quickly, then build another industry or buy some primary producers, depending on the map.

4/ The tricky bit. You have to make enough money to build a steel mill near Torreon in early 1876. Stockpile that cash, and build that mill. This is essential.

5/ Now you can think about railroads, because you have a solid infrastructure that will produce stuff for you to ship. You need this first, because at the start of the game Mexico has almost nothing to ship and nowhere to ship it to. The first industries you build will make decent profits for long enough to get money for railroads, and once you have money for railroads you can keep the industry profits up.

6/ Build a line from Reynosa to Torreon, via Monterey. Don't run it up to Saltillo yet. Keep it low along the valley and you'll get good grades, apart from the last little section into Monterey. I usually have a train running Brownsville > Reynosa > Monterey and another running Brownsville > Monterey. These two trains go into operation first while I wait or a little more cash.

I put a maintenance shed and a water tower on spurs at Brownsville and Monterey, and schedule the trains to use them. You don't want oil dropping below 50% at any stage or reliability will drop sharply. Use a caboose on all trains as well. If you do all of this, you'll be rewarded with a very reliable service.

Once the cash is available, put a station at Torreon, with maintenance shed and water tower on a spur. A fully loaded Consolidation will get from Torreon to Monterey without running out of water, and without the oil getting below 50%. If you are careful about track laying into Monterey, you can get them to haul 6 cars of any cargo. Build the track to Monterey and put two trains on this run, starting them wherever they will get the best first load.

You are now off to a good start, and can approach the rest of the game just by applying common sense. If you play it right, you should hit gold with about ten years up your sleeve.

Oh and regarding company debt, IMO you should be maxed out on bonds as soon as possible. Bonds are 25 year loans, and most scenarios will run out of time before you have to repay the bonds. You wont max out the number of bonds immediately, so over the course of the game you end up with more money in your pocket if you just pay the interest. IF you have refinanced all your bonds at 5 or 6%, it's better business to pay the interest on 10 million worth of bonds and use the money for expansion.

[OilCan]

5/ Now you can think about railroads, because you have a solid infrastructure that will produce stuff for you to ship. You need this first, because at the start of the game Mexico has almost nothing to ship and nowhere to ship it to. The first industries you build will make decent profits for long enough to get money for railroads, and once you have money for railroads you can keep the industry profits up.

Preach on! Your strategy is true for most games; get the industry base started first, lay rails second. But start with care. The first 2-3 industries you start with will either make or break your game. Building up your industry while building out your railroad will catapult you into the upper ranks of the stinking rich.

I put a maintenance shed and a water tower on spurs at Brownsville and Monterey, and schedule the trains to use them. You don't want oil dropping below 50% at any stage or reliability will drop sharply. Use a caboose on all trains as well. If you do all of this, you'll be rewarded with a very reliable service.

Oh.... the ol' caboose debate is about to start. There are some on this forum who will agree with you and and there are some who think a caboose does not deliver reliability as promised and is a waste of 1 of the 8 precious cars in the consist. I like cabooses only because I like to see them (nostalga), but I often leave them off at the start of a game when I'm trying to squeeze as much profit as I can from my trains.

Oh and regarding company debt, IMO you should be maxed out on bonds as soon as possible. Bonds are 25 year loans, and most scenarios will run out of time before you have to repay the bonds. You wont max out the number of bonds immediately, so over the course of the game you end up with more money in your pocket if you just pay the interest. IF you have refinanced all your bonds at 5 or 6%, it's better business to pay the interest on 10 million worth of bonds and use the money for expansion.

Exactly right! - However, late in a game in which company book value or personal net worth is a goal, it is wise to pay off all the bonds and boost company book value (it also helps boost share prices). But you make an excellent point in borrowing as much as possible to expand your rail & industry empire during a game.

BTW, I'm glad you did not mention micromangement.

[Gumboots]

Preach on! Your strategy is true for most games; get the industry base started first, lay rails second. But start with care. The first 2-3 industries you start with will either make or break your game. Building up your industry while building out your railroad will catapult you into the upper ranks of the stinking rich.

Yeah, it took me ages to twig to that. Once the light bulb went on, things started making sense. There are the odd exceptions, but in most games industry first is the only way to go. Beginners naturally think "Hey this game is all about trains" but forget that trains only exist to exploit price differentials between different areas, and price differentials are basically all about industry of some sort. You need solid production. If it doesn't exist at the start of the game, you have to create it yourself.

Oh.... the ol' caboose debate is about to start. There are some on this forum who will agree with you and and there are some who think a caboose does not deliver reliability as promised and is a waste of 1 of the 8 precious cars in the consist. I like cabooses only because I like to see them (nostalga), but I often leave them off at the start of a game when I'm trying to squeeze as much profit as I can from my trains.

I've tried it both ways. Ok, let me rephrase that. I've tried running with cabooses and without them, and it seems to me that they do have a benefit. I know the reliability bar gets a lot better when the train is loading and the caboose goes on, so obviously the game is registering something there. From what I can tell, it does seem to translate into increased reliabilty in practice. Whether it is as much as the brochure says is another matter.

Exactly right! - However, late in a game in which company book value or personal net worth is a goal, it is wise to pay off all the bonds and boost company book value (it also helps boost share prices). But you make an excellent point in borrowing as much as possible to expand your rail & industry empire during a game.

BTW, I'm glad you did not mention micromangement.

TBH I'm not sure about paying off bonds even in that situation. The way I look at it, any decent railroad run will return around 10% long term, and any industry I build will probably return 20%. Even if I buy an established industry, it will usually return 8-10%. This means I'm ahead of the interest rate, so it makes sense to have the money invested in my company rather than paying off the bond. That's fine until I get to the point where there are no profitable ways to expand (either in rail or in industry). When that point comes, I can use the cash flow to pay off bonds, or to buy back stock, or for dividends.

Forking out lots of cash for dividends doesn't usually seem to work well. Paying off bonds will decrease the debt, but also decreases the company's cash reserves by the amount of the bond plus the brokerage fees. The net effect on CBV is close to neutral if you are talking about the last few years of the game. Same seems to apply to the effect on share price at that stage of the game, from what I can tell, so it doesn't seem to help PNW much either. If the cash flow is used to buy back stock (assuming there is still any to be bought) that will drop the CBV but increase the share price, which defnitely boosts PNW in the short term. If I have to make a PNW goal at the end of a game, I think it's better to buy back stock.

One thing I have noticed though is that buying lots of shares on margin seems to make the economy less stable. I have a strong suspicion that the game is coded so that it is more likely to feed you recessions when it knows doing this will make you vulnerable to margin calls.

And micro management sucks. I value what is left of my sanity.

[Gumboots]

SInce I was testing on this scenario last night, I tried something different just for fun.

Usually I hook up Brownsville > Reynosa > Monterey > Torreon as my first big run, then go to Chihuahua, then go to Mexico City via Zacatecas, then buy into Texas and go to Houston.

This time I decided to hook up the west coast of Mexico straight after doing the Brownsville > Torreon run. The cargo map shows the west coast completely empty of anything, but if you hook up the cities there they will suddenly start generating quite a lot of express traffic. Sometimes I do this just for fun when I'm playing around after getting gold, but this time I thought I'd do it early to see if it could spice things up.

Immediately after Torreon, I ran track and trains up to Durango. Then I hooked up the west coasts towns from Tepic to Los Mochis. I've found there's not much point going south of Tepic, as the runs are not really profitable. I have gone up to Hermosillo in the north before, but I didn't bother this time. Anyway, the next step was to spend 4 million on a 6% tunnel from Mazatlan to Durango. This ended up being quite a reasonable earner. The goods, booze, etc coming in via Durango spiced up the west coast economy a bit, and there was also good express traffic betwen Mazatlan and Durango.

After that I built some more industry and saved up the 10 million for access rights to Texas (company was generating around 4 million a year profit by the mid 1880's), then proceeded on to Houston. Then I finally went from Torreon to Chihuahua and Durango to Mexico City. Got gold in late 1890.

This strategy seems to be about as good as any other in terms of results. If playing on Expert setting, it's difficult to get gold much before 1890 anyway.

[gismoskip]

I did it in eight years on expert and with NO INDUSTRIES LOL! you guys don't know the secret of this map yet . .