Red River Valley - Beta Version
Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Final version has been sent to Hawk for the map archive. Thanks to all for the helpful comments.
Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Hi,
I want to thank everyone for all the great posts about Red River Valley. And, kudos, most of all to its creator.
It is a fun game, and I am just beginning.
I played once up to April 1847. I had just delivered my 50th ingot and was thinking about relieving the congestion at Stanton
I remembered the screen shot of the two stations with double track, and thought I would play with it.
Here is what happened.
When I went to double track the existing track. it refused to let traffic travel on the new double track. It therefore concluded that I had failed to connect Stanton and Clay City and said I lost the game. Hmmm. I had just saved the game
so I tried it several times.
Each time, the "normal" way I have double tracked over single track before, does not work. It ends the game. I go the track box, select double track. Then I click on one end of the track and drag along the track as I want to double it. It works fine, but the trains refused to travel on it. This happens whether there was a train atop the Old single track or not. Am I doing something wrong, or is this a glitch (perhaps on my computer).
Also, when you run two sets of double tracks the opposite way from Clay City (eg toward Star Gap), one set heads to Star Gap and the other set heads to (where?)....
Of note, I have FOUR quarries. I gather from this thread that this is unusual. All are together on the western edge of the map. I had just connected to them when I had my double tracking crashes.
Anyway, I am going to try it again, and try out some new strategies that I have learned. If anyone has an idea about the double track crash, I would like to know!
Thank again for creating this great game and for all the great comments on it too.
Cheers
Ed
I want to thank everyone for all the great posts about Red River Valley. And, kudos, most of all to its creator.
It is a fun game, and I am just beginning.
I played once up to April 1847. I had just delivered my 50th ingot and was thinking about relieving the congestion at Stanton
I remembered the screen shot of the two stations with double track, and thought I would play with it.
Here is what happened.
When I went to double track the existing track. it refused to let traffic travel on the new double track. It therefore concluded that I had failed to connect Stanton and Clay City and said I lost the game. Hmmm. I had just saved the game
so I tried it several times.Each time, the "normal" way I have double tracked over single track before, does not work. It ends the game. I go the track box, select double track. Then I click on one end of the track and drag along the track as I want to double it. It works fine, but the trains refused to travel on it. This happens whether there was a train atop the Old single track or not. Am I doing something wrong, or is this a glitch (perhaps on my computer).
Also, when you run two sets of double tracks the opposite way from Clay City (eg toward Star Gap), one set heads to Star Gap and the other set heads to (where?)....
Of note, I have FOUR quarries. I gather from this thread that this is unusual. All are together on the western edge of the map. I had just connected to them when I had my double tracking crashes.
Anyway, I am going to try it again, and try out some new strategies that I have learned. If anyone has an idea about the double track crash, I would like to know!
Thank again for creating this great game and for all the great comments on it too.
Cheers
Ed
Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Does this only happen in this map or are you having this problem in other maps?
Hawk
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Wolverine@MSU
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Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Are you exiting out of the track-laying screen? I've found that trains won't move on newly-laid track as long as you are still in the track-laying screen; they'll chug right up to the new double track and will then stop. Any trains on the track at the time of doubling will not move until you exit out of the track-laying screen.Stoneman wrote:Each time, the "normal" way I have double tracked over single track before, does not work. It ends the game. I go the track box, select double track. Then I click on one end of the track and drag along the track as I want to double it. It works fine, but the trains refused to travel on it. This happens whether there was a train atop the Old single track or not. Am I doing something wrong, or is this a glitch (perhaps on my computer).
Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Yup, I've found that too. Whenever I'm layng double track over existing single track, I always pause the game, then do the double, then exit the track laying screen, then resume the game. If I do that, the trains just keep moving at the speed they were travelling at before pausing. If I leave the track laying screen open, they stop dead when they hit the new double track.
Complete express car and caboose packs - Custom double tankers (Alternative F era) - Pennsy H3 Consolidation
Слава Україні! Героям слава!
Слава Україні! Героям слава! Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
I had this problem only with this map.
GUMBOOTS and WOLVERINE were exactly right. I have now tried this this morning several times, with no problems.
I had been away from RT3 for a while and forgot this point. I really appreciate the help,
as I tend to make simple mistakes that can be easily solved.
Thanks again.
Now, to haul a few ROCKS.
I really love this website because it has such great resources, in both maps and people.
Cheers
Ed
GUMBOOTS and WOLVERINE were exactly right. I have now tried this this morning several times, with no problems.
I had been away from RT3 for a while and forgot this point. I really appreciate the help,
as I tend to make simple mistakes that can be easily solved.Thanks again.
Now, to haul a few ROCKS.
I really love this website because it has such great resources, in both maps and people.
Cheers
Ed
Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Glad you like it.Stoneman wrote:I really love this website because it has such great resources, in both maps and people.
Cheers
Ed
Hawk
Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Just finished my first playthrough of this on Medium, and really enjoyed it! Gold in 25 years.
Interesting that the effect of low prices was that the old Industry Start strategy wouldn't work, and also even hauling goods wouldn't be very profitable, and so this became a passenger hauling game, and then mail, and even moreso with the optional new passenger carriages.
The bonus cash from hauling ingots especially, somewhat rock, and then mail were just icing on the cake after I got my passenger system taken care of. Maybe game balance could be a little less on passenger and more on bonuses? Certainly in the first 5-8 years the bonuses helped a lot. But then, realizing the need to maximize profits on passenger traffic, I kepts Norrises running until the P-8 became available late in the game. Replaced many with Americans, but not all until then.
One thing surprising that I enjoyed was being given permission to use the editor to sculpt ramps/etc., reducing all gradients to 2 or less in the beginning, and I picked the faster trains option, so Norrises were pretty quick and useful. But also just following a train with the camera locked to it you can see the cuts and banks and it looks natural, to scale, pretty cool in a lot of places. I've never done that in a game, or even when making a game.
No real shortage of materials, once you built rail out to them, though for the first few years is was just a couple of iron mines, a logging camp, and a distant coal mine, all producing slowly, not much fuel for ingots... but enough to start with.
I guess one thing, when following around a train like that, you notice the landscape is kind of dull. Needs more textures or higher density of trees or something...
But thanks for all the research and the great story, felt really engaged until about year 22 when I knew I'd meet my goals in a few years (ingots per year above 55 from then.)
Hmmm.. some stats from year 1871 as I let the game run, sadly no more story messages...
Total loads hauled
2855 Passenger
939 Mail
575 Ingots
483 Corn
276 Coal
274 Produce
260 Iron
230 Clothing
173 Rock
116 Logs
Interesting that the effect of low prices was that the old Industry Start strategy wouldn't work, and also even hauling goods wouldn't be very profitable, and so this became a passenger hauling game, and then mail, and even moreso with the optional new passenger carriages.
The bonus cash from hauling ingots especially, somewhat rock, and then mail were just icing on the cake after I got my passenger system taken care of. Maybe game balance could be a little less on passenger and more on bonuses? Certainly in the first 5-8 years the bonuses helped a lot. But then, realizing the need to maximize profits on passenger traffic, I kepts Norrises running until the P-8 became available late in the game. Replaced many with Americans, but not all until then.
One thing surprising that I enjoyed was being given permission to use the editor to sculpt ramps/etc., reducing all gradients to 2 or less in the beginning, and I picked the faster trains option, so Norrises were pretty quick and useful. But also just following a train with the camera locked to it you can see the cuts and banks and it looks natural, to scale, pretty cool in a lot of places. I've never done that in a game, or even when making a game.
No real shortage of materials, once you built rail out to them, though for the first few years is was just a couple of iron mines, a logging camp, and a distant coal mine, all producing slowly, not much fuel for ingots... but enough to start with.
I guess one thing, when following around a train like that, you notice the landscape is kind of dull. Needs more textures or higher density of trees or something...
But thanks for all the research and the great story, felt really engaged until about year 22 when I knew I'd meet my goals in a few years (ingots per year above 55 from then.)
Hmmm.. some stats from year 1871 as I let the game run, sadly no more story messages...
Total loads hauled
2855 Passenger
939 Mail
575 Ingots
483 Corn
276 Coal
274 Produce
260 Iron
230 Clothing
173 Rock
116 Logs
Re: Red River Valley - Beta Version
Well I finally got done with this scenario. I downloaded it awhile ago but have not had much time for playing scenarios as of late. I'll have to go back and check and see if I played the beta or the final version.
My first attempt didn't last very long as I bought a fruit farm or two immediately at the start of the game, only to then get a message in a month or two that "inflation" and a depressed economy are at work in this game so my industries were now liabilities rather than assets. Not only that but 2 of the 3 iron mines southeast of Stanton and east of Irvine, had disappeared within a couple years. So I reloaded to the point before I bought any industries and started again with the knowledge that industries aren't a viable option for income at the start of the game.
In my 2nd run, I completed the initial connections, connected the iron east of Irvine (and bought them so they wouldn't disappear), and then built out east from Stanton. I expanded into the Southeastern county (I'll look up the names and edit this later). Connecting the logging camps, coal mines, and iron mines as they popped up. From there I connected to the Northwestern county with the rock, I didn't really care about the rock at the time, as I really just wanted to get into the other county where iron mines were located and I didn't want to cross over the mountains/hills. But while I was there I figured I'd connect the large city and create a few profitable train routes from it and connect to the 2 quarries and have trains sit there collecting rock. From there I continued to expand and went to the northeastern county with the coal mines, and then the northern county with the logs. Other random bits of information: I built a couple paper mills by logging camps as they were an industry that as long as adequately supplied they would make a profit, and take advantage of hotels/restaurants/taverns in at least larger cities as they make enough money to justify their initial expense.
I ended up getting the gold on expert around January of 1866, I might have had it at the end of 1865 but I had to finish connecting cities. The last few years I just set it on the fastest speed and let it run. After the hauling goals were met I finished connecting the last of the cities I needed. I made it up to around 58 cities before I just wanted to speed up the game and see if it was even possible to meet the ingot hauling goal, and the ingots increased from low 20s to 30s to 50 a year and the goal was easily met in the end. Overall with this scenario, the early part of it is the hardest and until the last 10-15 years it seems questionable as to whether the gold is even attainable. Then about halfway through the scenario, money just comes rolling in, and the 2nd furnace allows you to double your production of ingots (more if upgraded). The amount of money that comes in the second half of the scenario may even be too much.
I think I took advantage of the extra logging camps every time. (except maybe the last time). I built the train yard as the 50% reduced maintenance costs on my already aging (and always expanding) fleet of trains was too good to pass up and I figured the 200k a year it would cost to keep the train yard would be more than offset with the reduced maintenance costs and allow me to run some older locomotives longer before upgrading them. I passed on the 15% discount on track which would cost me an ingot every year because I had decent profits at the time which were still growing and at the time I thought I would need every ingot I could get. I also passed on the new locomotive as I figured I'd get the Consolidation soon, which I ended up not need getting soon enough to make any use of as I had reached the goals. I took advantage of the 2nd furnace and upgraded it. I only rerouted a couple of nearby coal/log trains to this furnace. Instead I had a some trains make a circle starting from Stanton and hauling iron/coal/etc to Vortex, they then waited there for ingots and hauled those to Irvine with a route through the mountains. While the mountains were not an ideal route, the trains mainly had to go down the steep portions of it rather than up so I didn't mind too much.
Couple comments:
- It a couple messages, the train yard is called a trail yard. (in 1853 and 1858)
- The 1855 message about coal producing 2 cast iron ingots vs logs only producing 1 seems a little late. While it is interesting background knowledge, the pertinent scenario knowledge of coal = 2 ingots might be more useful if it comes earlier in the game.
- For me there were 2 rock quarries which both put out a limited number of rocks, although towards the end they seemed to produce more. Given that 1 load of rocks can make 3 ingots, I can see why they were scarce. [This may be different If I played the beta, not the final version]
- The number of messages at the year's end, especially towards the end of the scenario feels a like a lot. Maybe it would be possible to combine the messages all into 1 or 2. Ex. This year got X from ingots, Y from rock, Z from mail, Bonus from the govt, but missed out on the moonshine bonus.
Overall it was a challenging scenario at the start with the depressed economy and difficulty in making a profit with industries. Halfway through it, it got a lot easier. It was a nice scenario, that was a little different than I am used to without the ability to depend on industry as my main source of income.
My first attempt didn't last very long as I bought a fruit farm or two immediately at the start of the game, only to then get a message in a month or two that "inflation" and a depressed economy are at work in this game so my industries were now liabilities rather than assets. Not only that but 2 of the 3 iron mines southeast of Stanton and east of Irvine, had disappeared within a couple years. So I reloaded to the point before I bought any industries and started again with the knowledge that industries aren't a viable option for income at the start of the game.
In my 2nd run, I completed the initial connections, connected the iron east of Irvine (and bought them so they wouldn't disappear), and then built out east from Stanton. I expanded into the Southeastern county (I'll look up the names and edit this later). Connecting the logging camps, coal mines, and iron mines as they popped up. From there I connected to the Northwestern county with the rock, I didn't really care about the rock at the time, as I really just wanted to get into the other county where iron mines were located and I didn't want to cross over the mountains/hills. But while I was there I figured I'd connect the large city and create a few profitable train routes from it and connect to the 2 quarries and have trains sit there collecting rock. From there I continued to expand and went to the northeastern county with the coal mines, and then the northern county with the logs. Other random bits of information: I built a couple paper mills by logging camps as they were an industry that as long as adequately supplied they would make a profit, and take advantage of hotels/restaurants/taverns in at least larger cities as they make enough money to justify their initial expense.
I ended up getting the gold on expert around January of 1866, I might have had it at the end of 1865 but I had to finish connecting cities. The last few years I just set it on the fastest speed and let it run. After the hauling goals were met I finished connecting the last of the cities I needed. I made it up to around 58 cities before I just wanted to speed up the game and see if it was even possible to meet the ingot hauling goal, and the ingots increased from low 20s to 30s to 50 a year and the goal was easily met in the end. Overall with this scenario, the early part of it is the hardest and until the last 10-15 years it seems questionable as to whether the gold is even attainable. Then about halfway through the scenario, money just comes rolling in, and the 2nd furnace allows you to double your production of ingots (more if upgraded). The amount of money that comes in the second half of the scenario may even be too much.
I think I took advantage of the extra logging camps every time. (except maybe the last time). I built the train yard as the 50% reduced maintenance costs on my already aging (and always expanding) fleet of trains was too good to pass up and I figured the 200k a year it would cost to keep the train yard would be more than offset with the reduced maintenance costs and allow me to run some older locomotives longer before upgrading them. I passed on the 15% discount on track which would cost me an ingot every year because I had decent profits at the time which were still growing and at the time I thought I would need every ingot I could get. I also passed on the new locomotive as I figured I'd get the Consolidation soon, which I ended up not need getting soon enough to make any use of as I had reached the goals. I took advantage of the 2nd furnace and upgraded it. I only rerouted a couple of nearby coal/log trains to this furnace. Instead I had a some trains make a circle starting from Stanton and hauling iron/coal/etc to Vortex, they then waited there for ingots and hauled those to Irvine with a route through the mountains. While the mountains were not an ideal route, the trains mainly had to go down the steep portions of it rather than up so I didn't mind too much.
Couple comments:
- It a couple messages, the train yard is called a trail yard. (in 1853 and 1858)
- The 1855 message about coal producing 2 cast iron ingots vs logs only producing 1 seems a little late. While it is interesting background knowledge, the pertinent scenario knowledge of coal = 2 ingots might be more useful if it comes earlier in the game.
- For me there were 2 rock quarries which both put out a limited number of rocks, although towards the end they seemed to produce more. Given that 1 load of rocks can make 3 ingots, I can see why they were scarce. [This may be different If I played the beta, not the final version]
- The number of messages at the year's end, especially towards the end of the scenario feels a like a lot. Maybe it would be possible to combine the messages all into 1 or 2. Ex. This year got X from ingots, Y from rock, Z from mail, Bonus from the govt, but missed out on the moonshine bonus.
Overall it was a challenging scenario at the start with the depressed economy and difficulty in making a profit with industries. Halfway through it, it got a lot easier. It was a nice scenario, that was a little different than I am used to without the ability to depend on industry as my main source of income.